tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7898782635470765614.post6029051330536412602..comments2023-09-11T17:58:13.764-04:00Comments on The Rebbetzin's Husband: Davening with secular tunesThe Rebbetzin's Husbandhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/14977193945074906534noreply@blogger.comBlogger13125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7898782635470765614.post-80029829975305750782010-11-16T17:16:50.070-05:002010-11-16T17:16:50.070-05:00Anonymous-
Interesting, thanks!Anonymous- <br />Interesting, thanks!The Rebbetzin's Husbandhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14977193945074906534noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7898782635470765614.post-78631534711612248542010-11-16T15:58:06.126-05:002010-11-16T15:58:06.126-05:00sorry, paitan, not paiyansorry, paitan, not paiyanAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7898782635470765614.post-91190593511375650052010-11-16T15:57:17.794-05:002010-11-16T15:57:17.794-05:00just went to a class in piyut from
קהילות שרות
(h...just went to a class in piyut from <br />קהילות שרות<br />(http://kehilotsharot.org.il)<br />and today the paiyan was temani.<br />he brought a big tin can to drum on, <br />and said that the reason temanim <br />traditionally don't use proper musical <br />instruments, and instead use improvised <br />whatever is because of horban habayitAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7898782635470765614.post-82601938112646505392010-11-15T08:07:22.185-05:002010-11-15T08:07:22.185-05:00Sorry, didn't record it. The setting was more ...Sorry, didn't record it. The setting was more informal than I prefer for YUTorah shiurim.The Rebbetzin's Husbandhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14977193945074906534noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7898782635470765614.post-84872758678562417322010-11-15T02:51:18.002-05:002010-11-15T02:51:18.002-05:00was that class posted on Toronto Torah? I coud not...was that class posted on Toronto Torah? I coud not find it.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7898782635470765614.post-67376921564604681902010-11-02T17:59:43.773-04:002010-11-02T17:59:43.773-04:00nice post..keep it up and keep on posting..nice post..keep it up and keep on posting..Philwebserviceshttp://philwebservices.i.ph/blogs/philwebservices/2010/06/03/philwebservices-guide-to-choosing-high-volume-philippine-web-hosting-provider/noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7898782635470765614.post-57698229191129675502010-11-02T04:25:12.164-04:002010-11-02T04:25:12.164-04:00I'm no musicologist, but I've been told th...I'm no musicologist, but I've been told that a lot of the Ashkenaz chazanut has a connection to secular classical tunes.Batyahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09402874037427009327noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7898782635470765614.post-30723381948014211432010-11-01T17:52:25.208-04:002010-11-01T17:52:25.208-04:00Joel-
Think I've blogged some of this somewher...Joel-<br />Think I've blogged some of this somewhere...<br /><br />ProfK-<br />1. If the music is primarily used in a secular setting, I don't think the composer's identity would matter. Based on the responsa, it seems that the concern is for the mental associations linked to the music.<br />2. Wedding - Interesting.The Rebbetzin's Husbandhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14977193945074906534noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7898782635470765614.post-58043337345020163932010-11-01T10:40:16.191-04:002010-11-01T10:40:16.191-04:00ProfK,
He (interestingly) doesn't address the...ProfK,<br /><br />He (interestingly) doesn't address the question of tunes for davening. The question was "is it problematic that all the frum weddings play music by this composer who wasn't so observant?" R' Moshe replied with the ritual/mundane distinction (a Torah scroll written by a heretic, or someone who later became a heretic, is the former), and explained that wedding music is mundane.Shalom Rosenfeldnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7898782635470765614.post-43724141346596628832010-11-01T10:15:02.588-04:002010-11-01T10:15:02.588-04:00Shalom,
Interesting distinction between "ritu...Shalom,<br />Interesting distinction between "ritual" and "non-ritual" use. By "ritual" does this mean strictly used in davening in shul, or does ritual also refer to things like zemiros sung on Shabbos or niggunim used for various parts of the Pesach Seder?ProfKhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17954446826821665314noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7898782635470765614.post-87181482908343006252010-11-01T08:57:13.572-04:002010-11-01T08:57:13.572-04:00ProfK,
R' Moshe Feinstein writes explicitly t...ProfK,<br /><br />R' Moshe Feinstein writes explicitly that wedding music is not a "ritual" use. It's totally fine to speak of medical procedures or scientific theorems by their common names, even if those names reference a Jew who was a heretic/sinner. Even if the music was composed by a true heretic, it is permissible for non-ritual use, though preferably avoided by a Torah scholar. If the composer was just a sinner, not a heretic, then it's okay even for Torah scholars. (Rabbi Torczyner, please correct me if I misquoted here.)Shalom Rosenfeldnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7898782635470765614.post-32950360610056546412010-11-01T07:36:16.291-04:002010-11-01T07:36:16.291-04:00Is there a difference if the composer of that secu...Is there a difference if the composer of that secular music is Jewish? While Jews only represent about 10% of classical composers, they represent 50% of modern music composers. The Wiki has a 401 page listing of composers--200 pages are of Jewish composers. And what if a composer wrote both secular and specifically Jewish music, such as Carlebach?<br /><br />You mention specifically tunes that would be used in davening in shul. What of the music that is played at Jewish weddings, many of which have a secular origin?ProfKhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17954446826821665314noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7898782635470765614.post-90923929839852031472010-11-01T05:38:03.899-04:002010-11-01T05:38:03.899-04:00hmmmm - an interesting shiur would be on why chaz...hmmmm - an interesting shiur would be on why chazanim and rabbis couldn't just get along?<br /><br />see aruch hashulchan o"c 53:13 as an example.<br /><br />KT<br />Joel RichAnonymousnoreply@blogger.com